ecosophia | Open (More or Less) Post on Covid 195

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Open (More or Less) Post on Covid 195

We are now in the fourth year of these open posts. When I first posted a tentative hypothesis on the course of the Covid phenomenon, I had no idea that discussion on the subject would still be necessary more than three years later, much less that it would turn into so lively, complex, and troubling a conversation. Still, here we are. Crude death rates and other measures of collapsing public health are anomalously high in many countries, but nobody in authority wants to talk about the inadequately tested experimental Covid injections that are the most likely cause; ~~public health authorities~~ government shills for the pharmaceutical industry are still trying to push through laws that will allow them to force vaccinations on anyone they want; public trust in science is collapsing; and the story continues to unfold.

So it's time for another open post. The rules are the same as before:

1. If you plan on parroting the party line of the medical industry and its paid shills, please go away. This is a place for people to talk openly, honestly, and freely about their concerns that the party line in question is dangerously flawed and that actions being pushed by the medical industry and its government enablers are causing injury and death on a massive scale. It is not a place for you to dismiss those concerns. Anyone who wants to hear the official story and the arguments in favor of it can find those on hundreds of thousands of websites.

2. If you plan on insisting that the current situation is the result of a deliberate plot by some villainous group of people or other, please go away. There are tens of thousands of websites currently rehashing various conspiracy theories about the Covid-19 outbreak and the vaccines. This is not one of them. What we're exploring is the likelihood that what's going on is the product of the same arrogance, incompetence, and corruption that the medical industry and its wholly owned politicians have displayed so abundantly in recent decades. That possibility deserves a space of its own for discussion, and that's what we're doing here.

3. If you plan on using rent-a-troll derailing or disruption tactics, please go away. I'm quite familiar with the standard tactics used by troll farms to disrupt online forums, and am ready, willing, and able -- and in fact quite eager -- to ban people permanently for engaging in them here. Oh, and I also lurk on other Covid-19 vaccine skeptic blogs, so I'm likely to notice when the same posts are showing up on more than one venue.

4. If you plan on making off topic comments, please go away. This is an open post for discussion of the Covid epidemic, the vaccines, drugs, policies, and other measures that supposedly treat it, and other topics directly relevant to those things. It is not a place for general discussion of unrelated topics. Nor is it a place to ask for medical advice; giving such advice, unless you're a licensed health care provider, legally counts as practicing medicine without a license and is a crime in the US. Don't even go there.

5. If you don't believe in treating people with common courtesy, please go away. I have, and enforce, a strict courtesy policy on my blogs and online forums, and this is no exception. The sort of schoolyard bullying that takes place on so many other internet forums will get you deleted and banned here. Also, please don't drag in current quarrels about sex, race, religions, etc. No, I don't care if you disagree with that: my journal, my rules.

6. Please don't just post bare links without explanation. A sentence or two telling readers what's on the other side of the link is a reasonable courtesy, and if you don't include it, your attempted post will be deleted.

Please also note that nothing posted here should be construed as medical advice, which neither I nor the commentariat (excepting those who are licensed medical providers) are qualified to give. Please take your medical questions to the licensed professional provider of your choice.

With that said, the floor is open for discussion.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I am very firm in this, this whole Chlorine dioxide thing sounds like a PsyOp to go after the antiwaxxers I see it spread in their social media and forum groups. Notice that it started after 2021 resistance to waxxines.

I my country and most of the countries they use Chlorine Dioxide to clean water and water with Chlorine Dioxide is worse than water without it. Also my biome started working better when I use water without Chlorine.

Much of the safety numbers are from the "Chlorine" industry that wanted to stilll selling it, it still being push into the tap water. Chlorine dioxide is being used for a century for the disinfection (called chlorination) of municipal drinking water.

Even the link you said says:

Further, no chlorine dioxide formulation product on the market either meets or has been evaluated in terms of quality and safety for oral ingestion and thus do not meet Good Manufacturing Practice (GMP standards. Also, even if the over the counter products are relatively safe, it is doubtful that people know how to correctly make or store the resulting solution. For instance, it must be mixed with distilled water and be kept out of sunlight in amber glass or plastic bottles (never metal!). Further,(when exposed to sunlight there is a chance that chlorine can be produced, something that can introduce the potential for harm).

Of course quality is a red herring here, this stuff is produced in industrial quantities and is not like you can do better at home.

Chlorine is bad for the skin and biome, and there are articles from before this issue was politicized by Trump in 2020 when he talked about the bleach thing.

The discovery in the 1970's that chlorination of water could result in the formation of potentially harmful trihalomethanes (THMs) caused concern amongst the water treatment fraternity and resulted in authorities reviewing chlorination practices in order to minimise THM formation and the United States Environmental Protection Agency (USEPA) setting maximum concentration limits for THMs in potable water. Many of the manufacturers and suppliers of water "purifiers" and alternative disinfectants exploit this information to their own advantage, misinforming the public regarding the dangers of chlorine, but even in the water treatment industry, chlorine is often misunderstood.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228724404_Chlorine_Is_it_really_so_bad_and_what_are_the_alternatives (2007)

Cancer is insidious, I think is an autoimmune thing and I think the healing should be with natural things that restore the immune system, immune system is mostly gut biome. Chlorine messes up the gut biome even if useful in cancer treatment should be last resort and the gut biome be restored.

Take for example B17 from natural sources. A lot of people testified to its potency yet it's deemed not safe, but the synthetic stuff was allowed. Its all about chemical synthesis and the money it makes for the industry.

I am starting to resent that I need to be antagonistic... but I think is important to speak the truth.

Chlorine has been in tap water for a century now and people that don't have chlorine in tap water don't have more cancers... quite the contrary.

"I am starting to resent that I need to be antagonistic... but I think is important to speak the truth."

Well, that is what this forum is all about, which is people considering all kinds of evidence and not be biased by one side or another.

I think you are quite confused here. Chlorine is what is used for disinfecting water. Chlroine dioxide is generally not. Chemically different compounds.

I knew from talking to folks who rear fish that they used to let a tank of water sit in order to let the chlorine dissipate or become inert before putting the fish in. But then water authorities started to use chloramine instead, which lasts a long time, thus necessitating them to use a filter to cleanse the water more thoroughly first.

Knowledge about chlorine dioxide has been around for quite a while, but like other really useful compounds, the information was automatically suppressed. Your impression that it's a 'new' thing in alt circles is wrong.. people were just more circumspect about it, the key question was always the dosing quantity, not whether it worked or not. I'm not an expert on it, but I do recall a few posters here have been using it for years to cure infections or other ailments - those stories rang true, they weren't trying to push anything, just providing info on what they've done.

Also knowing that something works is one thing. How to make the most effective use of it is often a much larger subject of study... e.g when is the best time to take it, with food or without, frequency, dosages etc.

I seem to have partly conflated Chlorine with Chlorine dioxide, while I was also looking for information into both.

Chlorine is used for water treatment and some pools
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine#Public_sanitation

But also Chlorine dioxide for water treatment just in some parts of the world indeed for almost a century
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine_dioxide#Water_treatment

I stand corrected on that, none the less my remark that Chlorine dioxide destroys the microbiota of the gut still stands.

These findings indicate than even low doses of CD can negative effect on the microbiota, the morphology of the cecum and colon, and body weight, suggesting that prolonged consumption should be avoided.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/39447834/

Chlorine is what is used for disinfecting water. Chlroine dioxide is generally not.

A quick check in any search engine will show that the_arcane_archivist is correct about the industrial use of chlorine dioxide. Chlorine dioxide is a disinfectant used in water treatment, food processing, paper production and medical settings.

Caldathras

At this point I think the Chlorine dioxide is now the flat earth equivalent. Some of the information in this case in this Wikipedia page is useful IMHO.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_Mineral_Supplement

Personally, I think life has no easy answers, but this whole Chlorine thing looks to me as a PsyOp the more I look at it. I see the same crowd and style in both...

People have given you some proper links, and used what we generally know to be reputable sources (e.g. Kory). Please stop digging.

You're getting too hung on on a similiar term... it's like when folks get a ga-ga when one of the unknown ingredients in the jab turned out to be luciferase... oh, lucifer, it's satanic etc. In esoteric terms, lucifer is not necessarily a bad symbol/representation, just made to be a bogeyman in more contemporary christian doctrine. In this case, it's a particular dye that's used in quite a few things... aka not inherently evil in itself.

Anyways... go back to basics. Most stomach related issues like acid reflux is result of NOT enough stomach acid. If your acid reflux is mild, you can take a betaine hydrochloride pill with every meal. it provides the raw ingredients to be converted to hydrochloric acid in the stomach. And yes, if someone is very deficient in stomach acid, they can take hydrochloric acid directly for faster results - the tricky part is not to let the acid contact too much of the mouth/throat/esophagus, special straws etc are used. You notice something? a form of chlorine is being actively used by our body all the time. I can tell you that when I actively supplemented with betaine HCI 3X a day, I just knew that my stomach acid was so strong that I tried half-rotten fruits - which would normally produce GI issues, but nope, the strong stomach acid killed all the pathogens before the food got to the intestines. So when some people are known to have strong stomachs, it basically means they can naturally maintain very high level of stomach acid and eat whatever they want, cooked or uncooked.

The next part of the digestive system after the stomach is the intestines - which is slightly alkaline. Yes, it goes from strongly acidic to alkaline. That's been one of the key insights from this covid era, that many supplements would actually work better if they are enteric-coated - aka doesn't dissolve in an acidic environment, but alkaline.

Our blood is generally at a neutral Ph... (you starting to see how our aamzing bodies maintain totally different levels of Ph in different critical parts of the body?). If you exercise hard, the energy conversion process produces excess hydrogen ions, which go into the muscles and blood, giving what people call 'lactic acid feeling'. Well, our body maintains a store of bicarbonate, which is released upon demand to neutralize that increased acidity... and so it's been known that taking sodium bicarbonate can greatly increase our physical endurance since the 70's Sodium bicarbonate = baking powder. However if you just take baking powder directly, it has to go through the acidic stomach first and most people get a nasty 'explosion' and need to use the toilet soon after. In the last couple of years, a company called Maurten's has come up with a sodium bicarbonate encased in their special hydrogel to address that issue, getting it past the stomach acid, and it works while charging $15-20 for each serving.

Since I have an understanding of how the different parts of the body work together, I made my own enteric-coated baking soda pills. Tried and tested for my kid.. it works. Cost me $0.50, with the baking soda being less than $0.10 and most of the cost coming from the enteric-coated pills. Much improved athletic performance and endurance.

That got me thinking - which of the supplements would be much more effective in enteric-coated form? I'm still learning and experimenting. Recently one of my mom's elderly friends had a fall at home, half dementia and the brain specialist that they saw started them on some gingko biloba pills is supposed to work much better than before. Gingko biloba helps memory.... and when I heart the story, I knew straight away that they had just made ie with enteric-coated pills, and jacked up the price at least 50x.

Baking soda is good stuff, way much safer though it can disrupt alkaline equilibrium if used to much.

Baking soda is used for cancer too, with good results.

I like the italian guy theory that say that cancer is some sort of mushroom. Cancer it is associated with mycosis in many cases. Also there are many mushrooms that work around cancer.

Chlorine and chlorine dioxide is so bad that I get allergies just from people washing the floors with it... Unstable chemistry and very toxic. I frankly don' know the people's fixation on it with that many natural therapies.

Wikipedia is gamed, it's not going to be a reliable source of information on anything that stands against Big Pharma's interests.

Everything is gamed, that's why you need discrimination...

if you use any corporate search engine, you'll get only big pharma sponsored results. if you try any of the remaining actual search engines (at this point i regard google and cousins as little more than propaganda servies), you'll get much more useful results. wiki is as bad as google. i have never seen a better example of the corporate takeover of search engines as this search:

https://yandex.com/search/?text=mms+chlorine
https://www.google.com/search?q=mms+chlorine

I'm with the_arcane_archivist on this. Chlorine is a known carcinogen and this has been known for decades. Chloramine (also a known carcinogen) is even worse as it will not dissipate from standing water like chlorine does. We chose the community where we live because they did not treat the water with either. Around here, it was not uncommon to meet healthy, active seniors in their nineties or older.

Recently, the municipal board was convinced to chlorinate the water, not to disinfect, but because it was the cheaper option in the process to deal with manganese levels in the water. Other methods could have been chosen but weren't.

The chlorine industry had been badgering this community for decades, particularly by influencing city bureaucrats, but the politicians had stood firm. Then the federal health department revised the acceptable manganese levels and here we are.

The simplest way to guarantee removal of chlorine or chloramine from your water? Add a small pinch of ascorbic acid to a gallon of the compromised water. That's right, Vitamin C.

Caldathras

As I was corrected and also the OP cited article, Chlorine dioxide only turns into Chlorine upon sun exposure.

when exposed to sunlight there is a chance that chlorine can be produced

Anyway I don't trust any stuff that turns into something even more poisonous upon sun exposure.

Take for example mushrooms exposed to the sun they produce D2 vitamin.

So to any health panacea: Be like mushrooms... turn better in the sun!

i'm going to recommend that you watch the universal antidote video, too. the first 30 minutes will teach you a lot about its safety. it is so effective a medicine, when used appropriately, that it cures even things like malaria within 48 hours. 30 minutes to learn about the molecule most hated by big pharma:

https://rumble.com/vdey7t-the-universal-antidote.html

As bad as Pharma is following I am not following an ex-scientologist to drink a substance that can turn into Chlorine in the sun and under some catalyzers and enzymes.

Based on a book that has a cover like this:

As JMG often says, I paraphrase: the opposite of a bad thing is usually also a bad thing!

Just to add a slightly different wrinkle to this.

(PS, this is not a statement in favour or against chlorine dioxide, as I have zero knowledge in relation to that specific compound).

However, it should be recognised that all living creatures crave a chlorine compound that we all take regularly in our food, and think nothing of it... namely sodium chloride - or salt.

Our stomachs produce an essential chlorine compound (and are especially designed to protect the rest of the body from its effects) without which we cannot digest proteins... namely hydrochloric acid.

Which is to say that while elemental chlorine gas IS indeed, deadly, there are many chlorine compounds that our bodies are familiar with, and are accustomed to transform and make use of for many purposes.

It is therefore essential to look past the simple fact that "chlorine dioxide" contains "chlorine", and strive to understand exactly what this compound is, and whether its effects are deadly or beneficial, or possibly either, depending...

Since I lack all familiarity with any of these latter topics, and therefore have no opinion on them, I will now bow out, and say... as you were... :)

I didn't know that salt had chlorine in it. I will not stop adding any of that poison to my food !

Can I replace it with sodium fluoride?

The body gets chloride (Cl⁻) from NaCl in trace amounts. In NaCl, Cl is tightly bound and stable. If you remember the chemistry class one of the most stable. Excess chloride can disrupt the body's delicate electrolyte balance, just like with other trace elements.

Garlic has arsenic in it. And garlic is used for health. You don't go and use industrial arsenic for that.

I was also checking sodium bromide for its edible value and came across this interesting history from wikipedia -

"Bromide can be regarded as the first effective medication for epilepsy. At the time, it was commonly thought that epilepsy was caused by masturbation.[6] Locock noted that bromide calmed sexual excitement and thought this was responsible for his success in treating seizures. In the latter half of the 19th century, potassium bromide was used for the calming of seizure and nervous disorders on an enormous scale, with the use by single hospitals being as much as several tons a year (the dose for a given person being a few grams per day).[6] By the beginning of the 20th century the generic word had become so widely associated with being sedate that bromide came to mean a dull, sedate person or a boring platitude uttered by such a person.[7]

There was not a better epilepsy drug until phenobarbital in 1912. The British Army has historically been claimed to lace soldiers' tea with bromide to quell sexual arousal and in the Victorian era prisoners in England were compulsorily dosed with the chemical.[8][9]"

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Open (More or Less) Post on Covid 195

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