ecosophia | Magic Monday

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Magic Monday

It's getting toward midnight, so we can proceed with a new Magic Monday. Ask me anything about occultism and I'll do my best to answer it. With certain exceptions, any question received by midnight Monday Eastern time will get an answer. Please note: Any question or comment received after then will not get an answer, and in fact will just be deleted. (I've been getting an increasing number of people trying to post after these are closed, so will have to draw a harder line than before.) If you're in a hurry, or suspect you may be the 143,916th person to ask a question, please check out the very rough version 1.0 of The Magic Monday FAQ here. Also: I will not be putting through or answering any more questions about practicing magic around children. I've answered those in simple declarative sentences in the FAQ. If you read the FAQ and don't think your question has been answered, read it again. If that doesn't help, consider remedial reading classes; yes, it really is as simple and straightforward as the FAQ says.

The picture? I'm working my way through photos of my lineage, focusing on the teachers whose work has influenced me and the teachers who influenced them in turn. I'm currently tracing my Martinist lineage. That's rendered complex by the Martinist tradition that one does not name one's initiator, so we'll have to go back through less evasive routes. Both of the last two honorees, and most of the other Martinist lineages in existence, were also taught and influenced by this man, Robert Ambelain, a prolific writer and occult scholar whose work extended from astrology and Freemasonry to Druidry and Martinism. Ambelain was born in 1907; he became an astrologer in the 1920s, proceeded to become a major figure in the Martinist scene and a bishop in one of the French Gnostic churches, played a central role in reviving several defunct occult orders, published 42 books, and earned the Croix de Guerre for his service to France during the Second World War. He died in 1997.

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~~With that said, have at it!~~

***This Magic Monday is now closed. See you next week!***

Threaded | Top-Level Comments Only

To share: the List of Ecosophia Abbreviations now has Jeff Russell's delightful definition of LARP.

To ask, I'm trying the protective amulet from the FAQ. To anyone who wears one, how often do you wear it? Do you wear it during sports, shower or swim? Do you keep it on at night?

As a folkish heathen myself in the UK I would say we see our Gods as linked to our people/ancestors in a similar way that native north American Indians do. So there is a racial component. However none of my group "Hate" any other people or groups. Having a preference for worshiping and socializing with a particular group of people is an expression of love not hate
Cealin

Maybe I should have said I belong to the Odinic Rite which does have people in the US.
The AFA has done well it's much bigger and if you are after community that's where I would go.
Steve McNallen has written constantly about Love of people not hate of others.
The non folkish heathen groups I have been involved with, have tended to be very progressive very woke and very intolerant.
Cealin

Hello JMG and others, hope you all are doing well!

1) Last week, you responded to another question about the Lord of the Rings, claiming JRR Tolkien, “boobytrapped the symbolism so it would be magically inert” for ritual/magical purposes.
How would someone (in this case, Tolkien) accomplish something like that? My practical knowledge of magic is sparse, at least for now, but I assume the symbols would have to contradict certain rules? For example, your recent Levi post talked about equilibrium; is Tolkien’s symbolism “unbalanced” somehow?

2) I suspect people have made similar attempts with other fictional stories, particularly those in the fantasy genre. Are you aware of any such workings succeeding? If so, would you be willing to describe the results?

Good morning and thanks as always for being willing to answer questions. This is unbelievably helpful. In the opening of the temple, if you are used to using a set of prayers every morning, should that be done before opening the temple, or should they be kept strictly separate and do everything exactly as written? Also, have you given suggestions for a gnostic SOP? I was thinking you had but I'm not sure I remember that correctly and can't seem to find it if I did. If someone were to go through all of your suggestions for various options of the SOP and make a file of them, would you have a place they could be made available,and do you think that would be helpful? Thanks.

Dear JMG,
Growing up I heard from elders that self destructive behaviors were rooted in sin (the big seven being sufficient in most cases) and or outside oppression or possession (the Devil made me do it!)

I suspect it’s complicated but what do your occult traditions say about things like addiction (sometimes called suicide for cowards) and the more dramatic and final acts of self harm?

Personally, I would recommend The Troth -- in addition to having a significant real world presence, their lore program and courses are excellent. Also, the AFA's Declaration of Purpose groups all white people together as if part of a single monoculture ("All native religions spring from the unique collective soul of a particular race."), not taking into account particular groups of people like Slavs and Celts whose cultures were not the same as the Germanic or Norse.

Do you know anything about the lore or history of people who are particularly lucky? Or any insights into the phenomena which I will describe? Is there a proper occult word for the positive version of people with this kind of talent/gift?

One of my children is particularly "lucky," or perhaps more precisely, able to manifest things she wants very easily. Example: a few weeks ago, we were walking out and about, and she said she wanted a cookie. We said no, as she'd already had a treat that morning. A few minutes later went into a coffeeshop to get coffee, and the barista took one look at her and said, "Would she like a cookie? It's on us." (Of course, we accepted.)

Another example, a bit less wholly positive: she expressed a desire to ride in a family member's car she'd had not ridden in for several months and really liked. It's a hassle to switch the carseats/boosters, and I told her it might be awhile before that happens. Lo and behold, the very next morning, our regular car got a flat tire. Guess which car we had to borrow to get around until it was fixed?

I have numerous examples like these two (with this one about the car being the only arguably negative one). She is a very ethical child. I observe her play (at a distance) almost 100% of the time because we homeschool and attend a co-op, and she is the one child who never has any conflicts with other kids, is never mean, never excludes anyone, and so on. When others are nasty to her, she usually just walks away (never fights back). When she is angry about something, she directs it all inward (tears and wanting to hide, usually). She has her faults for sure but she appears incapable of holding a grudge. What I'm saying is—-she doesn't use this power in a witch-like way.

Is there a word for people with this kind of ability who don't use it negatively?

For context, I've asked about her on here before. She is the same child who appeared to know the rosary from a past life, and who is obsessed with the Visitation and the Virgin Mary (who also helped me during my very difficult pregnancy with this child and twice she nearly did not survive). I have made sure to follow her wishes with that and bought her rosary beads, help her to pray regularly, and so on.

One last note that I forgot about for several years but seems interesting in light of the folklore around it--she was born with a small piece of the caul half over her face/head (doctor removed it immediately).

Thank you!

Greetings JMG!

I hope my comment found you in good health and humor. I am a big fan of your work.
Without further ado!

Questions:
1. can you tell me more about mushroom spirits? Maybe how to establish a relationship with them or what to expect from them?
2. Is it possible to use animal bones (obtained in a legal way, completely microbiologically safe) in druidism. One of the spirits I work with asked for a fetish in a certain bone.
3. do you know in what literature I can find internal alchemy based on pagan forces?
4. what books do you recommend to explore the subject of totems?
5. what can end up cultivating the energy of the deep underworld (described by you in druidic magic, among other things)?

Please forgive me so many questions :D and thank you in advance for your answers.

Oh yeah. I began the studies of the Order of Spiritual Alchemy. I need to get back to them, by the way. They are very good!
My problems are with those circumstantial events that occur on a daily basis, I don't resolve or discuss and I'm corroding with hate for months. It is a considerable expenditure of energy. Any advice on how to resolve this spiritually?

I had a vivid experience last week on the solstice and I am wondering whether it is the same kind of thing as scrying. Throughout the day I had vivid daydreams (that I did not create myself) of riding the subway in my prior city and feeling at peace. It felt like I was opening up mental or emotional blockages, stuck places, getting myself back to the spiritual state I'd been in when I'd lived there.

It also reminded me of how powerful and startling the lake was when I moved to this new place. It still is. The etheric force of the lake is enormous and I remember when I would be distraught at having moved here the lake would pop into my mind.

Then that night when I sat down to meditate about these 'daydreams' of riding the subway, in surprise I 'saw' the outline of a flowy person in front of me, like a heat wave. I couldn't see anything other than the humanoid-shaped wiggling and that they maybe had long flowy hair. I offered them a hug and got one, then they disappeared as far as I know.

So my question is: natural things like lakes have spirits, but do cities also? I'm wondering if the city where I left my heart has a spirit of some kind that said hello. Thank you.

Whew, glad to be back here.

1. Single line of inquiry in 3 parts, 2 questions 1 comment.

a. If submitting a work for publication and announcing it, I assume the best time for this is the day and hour of Mercury?

b. I performed a divination suggesting three publication dates, earlier to later: 1- IV of Pentacles, 2- Page of Wands, 3- King of Cups. Am I right in thinking that the later date is the best option?

c. The affirmation about sticking with projects until completion worked!

2. I met someone who might be of potential romantic interest and did a divination to see if it is so.

Result was: III of Cups

The 3 is not exactly what I expected, because although it's generally highly positive it's also strange -- could it mean: yes, but you might not be the only one?

Thanks!

-Deneb

Good Morning JMG
How do you define Chaos Magic - and any thoughts about it appreciated.
Many thanks!
(this is Jill C with a new account name;)

Hello everybody,
JMG (or someone here from Magic Monday),
Do you know any reliable druidic group with good roots in Brazil?
Tks in advance!

Thanks for both of your comments, Cealin. I am inclined to agree with much of what you've written. Since I do not think it is racist or hateful for Amerindian (and similar indigenous/ancestral) religions to be restricted to Amerindians, I do not think that forms of Asatru that have a similar racial/ethnic component are necessarily racist. As I said in my reply to Jeff, I think White racism involves actual hatred for non-White races and/or a belief that the White race is superior to all other races. So far, I'm not finding anything like that in the AFA's teachings.

In perusing Natural Magic I have been studying (but not practicing) Hoodoo and came to a thought that may apply here.

It seems we have two systems of Hoodoo, Open and Closed. Now I MUST stress this point every clearly - Open is not superior or inferior to Closed and visa versa. Let me say this again one is not better then the other.

If you forbears practiced a form of spirituality that you are rediscovering and you are very fortunate to have a living mentor or written instructions then you can approach that spiritual discipline with a different slant then someone who has no cultural connection with it.

Now reading about the AFA - I get the sense that we may have two concurrent systems that embody what Buddhist call the "Two Truths". How that would play out would depend upon ones starting point.

For example if you decided to connect with Odin and you had no ethnic connection, no in depth knowledge of the theology and no connection with people who practice then you would need to follow an "Open Odin" path - initiation, cultural study, dialogue and respect for those who practice would be baseline behavior. If in the process you get the hint that this is not for you then be respectful and move on.

If you were born into AFA and know people who practice and have a good, if unrefined idea of it and follow the culture then you can participate in the "Closed Odin" path - I would presume a lot of the formalities would be unnecessary but it would require a different process of study and spiritual dialogue and untimely an evolution of the very meaning of the AFA faith for yourself.

There are a lot of shades of grey in this - I am half Scandinavian by blood but culturally I grew up in multicultural polyglot southern California. I would not presume the "Closed Odin" path at all.

Thank you for the suggestion. I've looked over The Troth's website and I've encountered what, for me, are red flags. They have a DEI committee, and some of the position statements and official announcements on the "Latest News" page of their website leads me to think that the organization is probably on the "woke side" of things. I wouldn't be a good fit in such an organization.

On the subject of the AFA and a monocultural view of White people, that's a very fair point. An Englishman isn't a Frenchman, and neither are Polish. The cultures are distinct. But the situation in the United States is a bit different. I suppose we don't have much of a real culture to begin with. Different European peoples blended together, and a pan-European approach might be more tenable here. I'm not sure, though. I'll have to meditate about this aspect of the issue.

Hmmm, I'm not positive, but it might have been one of these two videos by Ocean Keltoi:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6SXC2mRS34
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLpFU9J1mfk

As you can tell from the titles, he does equate Folkishness with Racism, and he's against it. For some context, Ocean Keltoi seems to have some very progressive views, but in all the videos I've seen of him expressing them, he's done so in a measured and mostly respectful way. So, there's a definite viewpoint there, but he doesn't seem like a ranting ideologue. As such, I might recommend trying to find a pro-McNallen source to compare this with, if it does have the clips I vaugely remember.

I've actually known a number of Christians who claim "but that's not real Christianity!" I've noticed that is especially prevalent among American Catholics who are ardent supporters of Pope Francis. That this is the same sloppy thinking behind "but it wasn't real socialism" is enough to discredit the kind of Christian exceptionalism that individuals like Girard argue for. It was an interesting experience as I shed that kind of thinking myself. The last vestige of it was expunged (as far as I can tell) in some of the recent discussions on human sacrifice in Pagan cultures and the Christian practice of it by burning witches and heretics.

Edited 2023-06-26 16:23 (UTC)

Hello, Mr. Greer,

Hope all is well with you!

I have a question about the makeup of the etheric body. Does that body consist of the yogic subtle winds, channels, and chakras?

Also, regarding your recent essay on Balance in High Magic, Levi speaks of the three worlds that a magician must work on. What are those realms? Now, I equate them to the Buddhist Desire, Form, and Formless realms. Or Gurdjieff’s Earth, Astral, and Solar worlds.

Thank you, and I apologize for not picking this up from your earlier posts.

I'm not a Heathen myself, though I did seriously consider it a few years back after doing a ton of background research on the Norse/Germanic religion and the modern-day attempts to revive it, and consider myself to be an amateur scholar on comparative religions, FWIW. So take the following with a hefty grain of salt.

On that first bit:

"Racist hate group" today has mostly devolved into a neoliberal establishmentarian, thought-stopping slur-word for any human endeavor in the contemporary West that strays too far from the imperial orthodoxy of pseudo-cosmopolitan globalism. Yes, there are some historical groups that are deserving of this term (like the KKK, Nation of Islam, ect.), but the self-appointed "hate watchers" of today massively overstate the influence of a few selected examples over today's affairs, and of course has zero shame in conflating other, more currently-relevant groups when them; when in fact they usually have nothing much at all to due with historic "hate groups." As our gracious host as pointed out on several occasions, "hate" is to today's comfortable classes what "sex" was to the Victorian middle classes. "Hate-watching" has become the new form of heresy-hunting for those eager to score brownie points within those circles.

On AFA in particular:

To me, they seem magnitudes less hateful than their (very loud) detractors from the left/progressivist side of Germanic Neopaganism. From what I've seen, the average AFAer just wants to do their thing and be left alone. Sure, AFA's web site proclaims wignat (white nationalist) sorts of views on race (which I personally find rather cringe, but to each their own) and see their form of Heathenry as being foremost an ethnic religion. But so what? If someone doesn't agree with their views, there's plenty of other Heathen groups for them to choose from. Why can't people just do their own thing and leave others alone?

It does seem like AFA is one of the few modern pagan groups in the US who has successfully (besides maybe ADF) built local pagan communities and has actually established brick-and-mortar places of worship. Perhaps there's some envy going on, coming from the terminally-online type of pagan who can't even set up a proper temple in their living room, much less in a public place.

I think primarily, leftist Germanic pagans hate AFA and similar groups with such zeal because AFA membership tends to be comprised primarily of ordinary, working class white people, which is the primary demographic that is very fashionable and permissible for the affluent/comfortable classes to hate on in the current year. Leftist/Prog pagans OTOH tend to come from the latter classes. As per usual these days, most of the genuine hate seems to comes from those who are shouting the loudest and accusing everyone else of being hateful bigots.

On the Folkish ideology in general, I find it to be rather lacking philosophically, among other things. Like practically all of the alt-spirituality that emerged out of the 1960s counterculture, these movements are based a ton more on emotionalism, sentimentalism, and a sense of resentment against the Christian overculture, rather than any set of reasoned, systematic views on the Divine. Some Folkish views on the gods seem to border on atheism; like the notion that the gods are merely a product of the ethnic groups that worship them. The seems to reduce the Divine to mere anthropological and sociological phenomena (this rivals the "archetypalist" view embraced by other types of neopagans). The massive time-discontinuity of practice and belief between pre-Christian peoples and today is probably a major factor at play, and something that has plagued all the forms of "authenticity"-seeking modern paganism in general.

Having said all of that, if you happen to work in a PMC-adjacent career field or swim in that sort of social circle, public knowledge of you associating with a group like AFA could become a seriously liability to your reputation.

I do find it pretty sad that there isn't much of a middle-ground, third option between the woke/wignat binary that plagues much of Heathenry today. There is however a marginal "sect" of Germanic paganism, Theodism, which might be to your liking if you don't mind very pedantic reconstructionism with an exclusively Anglo-Saxon focus. They do seem to do a very thorough job keeping ALL politics out of their public materials and group functions, which is a refreshing (IMO) thing to see in this current year.

Potlach cultures found a way to solve this problem by attaching social status to what you could *give away* rather than what you *had*.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/potlatch

Related, there are/were native north american cultures where this takes the form of... if someone compliments something you own, you must give it to them. Keeps everybody in the group basically equal, and discourages the accumulation of goods. Probably a net plus in nomadic cultures in particular, where anybody having too much stuff is going to be a drag on the whole group when it's time to make the seasonal move.

I checked out The Troth a few years ago and they seemed to have gone all-in on the wokeness craze. From their web site, it seems readily apparent that they are totally intolerant of any political views that stray even an inch from their own, i.e. whatever the preferred woke/prog flavor of the month happens to be.

IIRC, this is the group Stephen Flowers (pen-name: Edred Thorsson) founded back in the early 90s. Not long after founding it, he quickly excommunicated from his own group because of his past associations with the Temple of Set (a rather edgy LHP initiatory organization); some of the membership base had a real aversion to anything connected to ceremonial magic and likely didn't want the group to get caught up in the Satanic Panic moral hysteria that was real big at the time. The woman who took over the group ended up leading it in a rather leftward direction and laid the groundwork for the sorry state it's in today.

Yep. The logical fallacy those Christians are using is the "No true Scotsman" fallacy. It gets a lot of workout any time somebody claims the same sort of exceptionalism that Girard is trying to claim for Christianity.

Hey JMG,

What is your opinion regarding Self-Initiation within the Golden Dawn Tradition (largely from the Cicero's text), do you see self-initiation as legitimate?

And how would you advise those who wish to proceed further than the self-initiation grades (up to Portal, I believe) but are not close to a nearby GD temple?

Thank you for your time.

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Magic Monday

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Do Cities have Nymphs?

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