ecosophia | Open (More or Less) Post on Covid 5

The semi-open posts I've hosted here on the Covid-19 narrative, the inadequately tested experimental drugs for it, and the whole cascading mess surrounding them have continued to field a huge number of comments, so I'm opening another space for discussion. The rules are the same as before:

1. If you plan on parroting the party line of the medical industry and its paid shills, please go away. This is a place for people to talk openly, honestly, and freely about their concerns that the party line in question is dangerously flawed and that actions being pushed by the medical industry et al. are causing injury and death. It is not a place for you to dismiss those concerns. Anyone who wants to hear the official story and the arguments in favor of it can find those on hundreds of thousands of websites.

2. If you plan on insisting that the current situation is the result of a deliberate plot by some villainous group of people or other, please go away. There are tens of thousands of websites currently rehashing various conspiracy theories about the Covid-19 outbreak and the vaccines. This is not one of them. What we're exploring is the likelihood that what's going on is the product of the same arrogance, incompetence, and corruption that the medical industry and its tame politicians have displayed so abundantly in recent decades. That possibility deserves a space of its own for discussion, and that's what we're doing here.

3. If you don't believe in treating people with common courtesy, please go away. I have, and enforce, a strict courtesy policy on my blogs and online forums, and this is no exception. The sort of schoolyard bullying that takes place on so many other internet forums will get you deleted and banned here. No, I don't care if you disagree with that: my journal, my rules.

With that said, the floor is open for discussion.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Just a note: data out of England seems to suggest the while it might help protect against severe disease, it actually is quite bad with preventing death - severe disease numbers are better for vaxxed, but seem worse wrt deaths

Tolerance could cause that, I would think. Less severe pneumonia caused by immune overreaction but more death associated with uncontrolled viral replication.

Mark L

Yeah i saw that thx to you. So they ran headlines here about 30x more likely to go to the icu if unvaxxd and I wondered why not just say die or talk about mortality. But they were being truthful so they left out the part about 2x liklier to die. Celadon

What is this “data out of England” suggesting increased mortality in vaxed vs unvaxed? If true and from a source widely considered reputable, it needs amplification.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/investigation-of-novel-sars-cov-2-variant-variant-of-concern-20201201

The consensus is they didnt adjust on over under 50 so factor that in. Older people more likely to vax and more likely to die independently of each other in at least basic aspect. But other than that adjustment the data shows more likely to DIE all cause mortality if vaxxd, and enough different cant just be the demographic component alone. that seemed last weeks consensus from those here that crunched it. Someone can correct me if i am misremembering. -Celadon

Is that actually corrected for age (and not just their stupid under-50 vs over-50)? Without that, it's impossible to draw meaningful conclusions.

It would be better for it to be more stratified, but it is still the best we can find - sadly most other sources of information, like the CDC, are way worse.. Its good enough to get a view of the general trend

I never dug into the raw data - but you might be able to reconstruct better age stratification from there.

My understanding is that it is not fully corrected for age or underlying conditions, and also that the death rates in both vaxxed and unvaxxed are very low relative to earlier waves of the pandemic. So I'm not convinced that it is a solid signal of vaccine-enhanced risk.

Mark L

Sort of like the actual virus itself? Those numbers have been twisted and distorted in a variety of ways as well.

Open (More or Less) Post on Covid 5

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